The Salty Splash Podcast -Tyson Heath.mp3

The Salty Splash Podcast -Tyson Heath.mp3: Audio automatically transcribed by Sonix

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This is the Salty Splash podcast's. Welcome to the Salty Splash Waterpolo Pod. The salty splash. We'll take a look at waterpolo grow from the perspective of water polo. Athletes, clubs, parents, referees and coaches exploring issues facing the growth of the sport we love at a local level. And we'll seek to have interesting and collaborative discussions with stakeholders to the game. My name is Sean Stringham and I look forward to creating conversation honoring the history of waterpolo, but more importantly, talking about the future of our sport. I live in Salt Lake City, Utah, where I am the men's head coach and club director of water polo. I serve on the Utah Water Polo and USA water polo mountain zone boards. I'll come at this podcast from the perspective of someone who has lived outside of California, always looking for best practices to grow the sport at every level splash ball, age group, club, high school and beyond. This episode features a conversation with Tyson Heath. Tyson is the chair of the USA Water Polo Mountain Zone Board. He is also a very high level referee in Utah that travels regularly, continue him hone his craft. We will talk about growth, the state of the sport in the mountain zone, how coaches and referees can work together to support the game. How clubs and teams can attract and retain athletes. And the best way for parents to get their questions answered by a referee on deck. The goal of this podcast is to create growth that will introduce more kids to the game and create quality, competition and development opportunities in our home of Utah Mountain Zone and ultimately across the country. Please subscribe. Great. Give a five star review and share the podcast. I look forward to bringing you regular episodes. Let's work together to bring the sport we loved every fall. Please feel free to engage on these and other waterpolo topics by finding Salty's Flash Pod on Instagram and Twitter. Join the conversation in the salty splash pod Facebook group. Or simply just email me at Salty's Splash Pod at Gmail dot com.

Let's keep the conversation going. All right. Well, we'd like to welcome everyone in. And now we have just brought Tyson Heath into the conversation for our Salty Splash podcast here. I'd like to welcome Tyson. Tyson is currently USA Waterpolo Mountain Zone president.

He's a very active referee. You see him on deck all the time. He's some of his past service to the water polo, has been the head referee in Utah High School Water Polo Association. First of all, Tyson, thanks so much for your service for the water polo community. And I would love to just kind of go back in history and just get a sense of how did you get into water polo? What's your origin story when it comes to water polo?

Absolutely. And thanks for having me, Sean. I love the name of the podcast's in the series.

It's very clever and creative. But you know what got me into polo? We moved back to Utah and we moved out to the Curran's area when I was in sixth grade. And, you know, out out in the Kernes area, the you know, the rec center was kind of where I first got introduced to one the swim team and started swimming in sixth grade. And then it wasn't really until about seventh grade when water polo got introduced to the younger kids.

Granted, this was well over 20 years ago.

And so the polo in the valley at the Polo, Utah, and even the polo at Kernes, the curves was a lot different than what it is now. Swimming was the primary focus and we would do polo in the off season during the summer, and we could start to begin to play till about seventh or eighth grade because there wasn't a lot of youth club. I participated in the first year that the Currence Ball week ever took place. As an athlete. And that wasn't until middle of my high school year. So, I mean, it's crazy to to see what club and age group polo is now versus the opportunities we had over 20 years ago.

Well, and we're going to have Brad on the podcast coming up as well. But he he loves to tell that story of like that first fall league was something like four or five teams.

And it was really just trying to get an opportunity for kids to get in the water. And that really did set the tone for the four waterpolo and the development of water polo in Utah, obviously. Did you play in high school or did you continue to play through a club? What did that look like for you?

Yes. So I continued playing through high school, played for Kernes High, graduated from there in 05, played two years for the university jazz club team.

And then that's when my passion for referee really began to evolve. And I left playing Club Polo, my junior and senior year, to begin to officiate and spend more time during this spring and the fall, committing and trying to learn the game from a different angle. As a referee and I'm sure we'll get into some of that and a little bit. But graduated from the you moved down to Las Vegas for grad school play masters with Team Vegas for a couple of years, understanding NIDA. And once again, that was a different experience, playing for a true year round Masters Club team, continuing to develop skills and just different aspects of the game.

So, you know, over over my 20 years of being involved in the sport, you continue to learn as the game has continued to evolve and you find different aspects within the game through the different the play, the refereeing, coaching over time that you find new things in the sport that you develop a passion for.

Right. One of it, I know you're in the water every once in a while. Now, as a master's athlete, I've seen it with my own two eyes. But you're most known around these parts about for being one of the best referees in the state of Utah. You've mentioned it briefly, but how did you get into refereeing?

What brought you into it? How did you get excited about it? What was part of your progression in terms of becoming a referee for USA waterpolo?

So as a as a senior in high school?

I thought I knew more at the game than the referees did. And so I had one of those personalities. I guess they say you're one of those kids. Yes, I have one. And I look back now and I feel bad for the referees that had to deal with me back in the day.

But I always I always work at the table.

And so I was always around the referees from, like my freshman year, you know, all the way to my senior year of working the tables during the girls. Maybe during the J.V. game or whenever Brad would have an out-of-state tournament come in, I would be working the table. And so I was always around the referees. I was always trying to learn more about the game. And then that led to just during practice, blowing the whistle a little bit, you know, seeing if I can handle it and if I could actually apply what what they were telling me and what they were explaining. Right at a high school right after graduation, I reached out to dawn. I was like my, you know, my colleague Madison Drewry to thank because she also was the one who helped kind of push and force us to go down the referee. And so the two of us went to the training. We wrapped our first season, and I think it was our fourth game ever. We did a game together at that river. It's a very a highlight of our referee career from that moment. It's stuck right in love with it. We found love, the sport, the atmosphere, the environment.

And, you know, over the 15 plus years of reffing, I mean, it's taken it's taken me all over the place.

It's allowed me opportunities to meet new individuals and continue to learn the game in a different way. And what officiating and referee is in itself, it's not just the water of also the skill set required to be a referee.

Right. It's amazing. I mean, I think one of the key things out of that last time and he just said that I have found amazing about waterpolo is the opportunities. Right.

I mean, if you kind of continue to dive down into it, there are places that I've been in at the same time, people I've met that I never would have had that kind of connection with it. And it's small enough community, really, that you can really find some really fun and interesting people to have conversations with. Obviously, your mountain zone president now, what are some of the other roles that you have in the game at this point? Are you. Do you have a list of those that you could share with everyone?

So, you know, waterpolo, as she said, it's a small community.

And so those that continue to evolve and stay in the community, there is an unwritten rule, unwritten rule of giving back to the sport. And that can happen in multiple ways. So whether it is serving in leadership positions, whether it's, you know, volunteering on social media, like I said, the administrative side of it or on the refereeing side, it's giving back. It's helping to train and educate newer officials without having a title.

That's just part of the responsibility as a senior official is to help get back to help train and guide new officials the same way that we were trained like I did back in the day, as well as do you ever attend an ODP camp?

The referees are volunteering their time to one, whether it's referee the scrimmages during the clinics or to at the competitions. Those referees are not paying paid to referee the game. They're volunteering. They're giving back and they're showing their commitment to the sport to allow them additional opportunities as they move forward. So some of those current roles right now, as you said, is serving as the chair of the zone. And then just really being an active participant with our newer officials and trying to help guide and lead them and then, you know, work with athletes on the side as that comes up.

Yeah. You've always been a great advocate for the sport. I appreciate that.

So we obviously, as we're recording this in mid middle May right at the moment of 2020, we just can't are in the middle of the covered pandemic. As of Mark at the middle of March or so, we kind of we ended up having to cancel or postpone the season. We didn't know at the time how it was all going to play out. In the end, it really has. This season has been canceled in the Utah spring season, which is one of the primary seasons here. Tell me, what did you miss the most?

Did you from did you ever had did you have any withdrawals or pangs as a referee? Did you miss anything from the season yet?

You know, it's actually a really good question because it's it's a yes and no.

Right. Where? Well, you know, the follow up question is invalid like that. Are you glad, Dennis?

Right now, it's the spring season. Within my own personal life with him, my my work career life, everybody knows that's water policies where Tyson is not at his desk. He's probably refereeing a game. East has a Friday off. He's probably traveling to go referee some tournament within the state or within the zone.

And so it has been interesting one, because it covered, you know, being at home, but to not go into a pullback, not having an escape way round. So by the time we do get to the end of the season, May I'm ready for a break, but I want to get right back into it a couple months later, because just like athletes and just like coaches, when referees are not referees, we're losing a little bit of our skill set. Right. And then we have to retrain for that. And it takes a little bit longer to retrain as we've got new rules that came into play a little bit this year. And so it is unfortunate, but I am glad that, you know, I was able to relax a little bit more. You're getting brain fat. Absolutely, miss. Participating as well.

Yeah. And it's it is it's so consuming in that springtime. We've had that conversation by you, but you really end up by the middle of May, just like, oh, you're just running on fumes. And at this point for even for me and I had a couple of conversations with with our athletes and stuff, it's like I've had the best sleep of my life for the last two months. It's been great. It's that. So that's been a good part. Let's I'd like to transition just a little bit and have you go ahead and put your hat on for the mountain zone chair. So in your in your mind, if we expand out of Utah and start talking a little bit more about the zone, if you give us a state of the zone from from your perspective as the chair? Well, you know, current status has how it has to do with coded zone championships, integration of teams and clubs across the different zones. I'd love to. I just love to hear your insight on the mountain zone.

Great question. So the the zone itself, the spring not just here in Newtown, but in other areas of the zone, and it's a very busy time in the mountain zone.

At the age group level. At the high school level and at the masters level. So, for example, you talked about how the Utah high school season essentially came to an end because of Kovik. That was also true in New Mexico at their high school season, was not allowed to take place at the Masters level. One of the largest Masters tournament that we hosted in our zone, the desert duel at LSU, did not take place. That's impeachment's opportunity within the zone. Some of the smaller tournaments that would take place in Duke for the Duke City annual tournaments are in New Mexico for the Duke City annual tournament. Nevada normally hosts a tournament. And then just Colorado being able to move throughout the zone to participate. So while there is a lack of opportunity, I also was able to see a lot of innovation that our teams and our club teams were doing with their athletes during this time, whether it was committing to dry land practices. And now we try to host a zone call. And most of those coaches were busy hosting a dry line practice. So we had to push back the time as a referee. That's not right. Just so everybody knows, the referees have not been doing dry land practices. You have a better pacing up and down the down low, lower your results that equable interacting exclusions. And I think that back I think that has really been great to see some of the innovation that our teams have done to keep their teams intact, because it can be a difficult time where the athletes find a new hobby, you know, during three months off or the financial implications.

That has been a concern from the zone level, from the state levels and from the national organization level, what it would look like in the future. So now those are things we're looking at, but the zone itself continues to stay strong. And your question about zone championships at this point? We have had to postpone soane championships. I won't be taking place in June. The zone board will continue to work with Rocky Mountain Neptunes, who were the host club this year to see if we can find an additional opportunity later in this year, if we can fit it into the calendar or if we pause the current cycle and go ahead and award them the tournament again next year in 2021, it will depend on what the calendar looks like as well as kind of where things are opening up and what this will look like. It is important to note that USA watercolor right now, it has put a hold on all sanctioned tournaments and scrimmages. And so we're also at the mercy of mines actually begins to open up.

Yeah. So one of the key reasons why I've decided to try to work on this podcast is just to try to create awareness among teams and clubs about what's happening outside of their own pool and maybe and create some awareness that goes along with that. As the chair of the zone of the Mountain Zone, what are some of the things that excite you the most about being involved with the zone level? And what are some things that teams can do to participate in and engage more at its own level?

That's that's really a great question.

You know, one thing that always excites me about this zone is the small family, but all of the coaches within the zone are. I mean, when when you take a look at the zone from the thirty two thousand foot, you add at the club level, age group level, there are two teams in New Mexico.

We have two teams in Colorado. We have two teams now in Arizona. One team in southern Nevada.

One team in northern Nevada. And then the bulk of the teams here in Utah. Right. So that the zone itself is a small family where they all have to rely and support each other. Same with the officiating. And if we look at first across the states. One thing that always excites me about the zone is just the pride of the zone. It's the largest geographical zone that USA to broadcast. It's also one of the largest zones outside of California. While it may be one of the largest geographical piece really comes into play. Right. What the zones limitations are. So right now, what always excites me is for continuing to grow. We are getting more teams. Colorado last fall hosted their first ever high school season with, I believe, six or eight teams. The growth's happening and it's happening organically. It's the same here in Utah with everything that's been going on. The master's level continues to grow throughout the zone as well. So those are some of the pieces that really excite me of kind of where we're growing is the growth and the commitment to collaborating, working with each other to make sure that their athletes. Have something to look forward to, whether it's a tournament or teams practicing together in the offseason.

Right. How about the flip side of that? Obviously, the geographic size of the zone is difficult, but what are some things that are frustrating? What are the things that we can do as teams and clubs to work together better and to help support and grow and support each other?

Absolutely. You know, there are a couple of frustrations that are outside of our limitation. Geography is a frustration, constant travel. Those are not those can be barriers and frustrations outside of our control. But, you know, some of the other limitations and frustrations that I see within the zone in some areas, the lack of commitment to year round Claypole, it just like anything to continue to get better and improve.

You must continue to work on your practice and your craft. Same with referee. If a referee only referees for eight weeks and then they don't do it again for another 40 weeks, they're never going to get better in that way. Same with when it comes to playing. So some of the frustration is the lack of year round commitment that we do have within the zone. The lack of travel within some of the teams within the zone. That's not just a frustration, I think, from the administration level, but it's also a frustration from the club growth level.

You know, the viability of us to continue to host tournaments when only the same couple of players continue to show up every time. Right. That can be extremely frustrating on my side and on the club team side.

And so discuss some of those opportunities. You know, a little bit later, maybe what we can do. But I would say overall, those are some of the larger frustrations, just the lack of commitment to year round and investing in travel.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, that that is obviously is hard. But I have found and from our perspective at Olympus that once we decided to commit to travel, that really just the club itself just exploded in terms of people were excited about it. We wanted to go and do it. And those are those are the moments that the kids keep coming back to. It's like, when do we get to go to Colorado? When do we get to go to Albuquerque again? When do we get to go to California? So that's been that's really been a fun part over the last several years as we've grown and developed our club to see that happen. OK, I'm going to I'm going to shift just a little bit and ask you to put your referee had on because because you have so many different roles here. One of the key things in terms of trying to grow the game of water polo, the sport of water polo, is the officials credibly key part of the game? Right. I mean, they're just like one of the actors or actresses in the game, really, as the teams go back and forth. From your perspective, Verm referee and referee training, what are some of the other ways that we can identify, attract, train and retain referees? I would love just some insight and feedback from from the referee side on that question.

And that's a really difficult question, because it's I wish I could say pinpoint X would be the perfect example of a referee mindset out, like, you know, if I could by cloning myself.

Right. I just need to drive. You know, I'd be a little scary. Right. You've seen the movie Multiplicity, right?

I'm dating myself like it's like to me, it all depends. And we see this all the time when it comes to the referee as well. What are they in it to do? Right. Right. One of the things that I touch on when when I do referee development and training is I don't necessarily spend a lot of time focusing on the USA waterpolo feeder rules. I focus on what it takes to be a referee. What are the characteristics of a strong referee? What are the opportunities? Certain characteristics that, you know, might be a little timid when it comes to a referee. And how can we address that?

To me, referees across the board, no matter the score, high level officials demonstrate the same characteristics. If I can find those characteristics in somebody, I can make them a good referee.

I can't keep the rules and teach you how to apply the rules. Now, does it help if you've played the sport a waterfall? Absolutely. Just like if I was a basketball ref, I've never played basketball.

I'm sure it would take me a little bit to learn the flow and the fill up the game. Same with our sport of water polo. If you've never played the sport even as a parent and you watch it or, you know, just a random spectator, if you haven't played this for you don't understand the film, the flow of the game. Right to me when it comes to the officiating, do you have the temperament and characteristics to be a referee as number one? And number two, can you understand? And one of the characteristics is, can you understand the flow of the game? If you if you can't understand. The flow of the game should work. When you should or should not be blowing the whistle, it's really hard to continue to progress forward right now because we're lacking some of those initial pieces. So ways to attract younger officials is if you see an athlete and they're interested in it, let them blow the whistle during practice.

Let them run the scrimmages a little bit. I understand maybe you want them in the water, but pulling them out of the water for 10 minutes to blow the game is a great opportunity for them to continue to learn.

I would never say I was the best player in the pool, and I don't think most my referee colleagues would say they were the top player MVP, but they all understood the game. And so that's where they excel as an official round. And the final point that I would make on that is Team Vegas, when it comes to their masters practice. They have their age group kids show up. Some of them get to play. Others entire job is to referee the scrimmage. There is somebody behind helping them if need be. But it's so that way they can see the game from a different perspective. To understand why a pass should go, let's say, from the one to the two versus one to five. Right. So it's very helpful, I think, at an earlier age to help identify and just see if somebody is interested in it.

I think I think I've seen as kids have come out of our programs who have wanted to become referees. Really. And you mentioned it. They may not be the best athlete on the team. And in fact, it's kind of similar to coach you. Just because you're the best athlete doesn't mean that you're the best coach or best referee.

But it's those folks who can kind of see that flow, understand, have the temperament for it. You know, you got to have a little bit of chip on your shoulder and like to be in charge and and be willing to tell these people who are probably bigger than you which direction they're supposed to be swimming and what direction they're not supposed to be swimming.

If we get into this, how can coaches and athletes and especially parents, how can coaches support? Referees, how what? What should be the attitude of a coach towards a referee? If you were to teach the coaches for just a couple of minutes of what that might look like. How can that best be managed?

That you know, that really is a great question.

And it works both ways in the relationship between a referee and a coach. To me, the number one fundamental piece between that relationship is respect. That to me is key. If a coach shows me respect, I'm more likely to show and demonstrate mutual respect to them. If a coach does not necessarily want to show me respect, that's fine. The lack of communication that we may have with each other will most likely be low. Does it change the outcome of the game? No. But it changes the dynamic and the fill with in the game. Right. And that, I think, is everybody can really sense there's something there's the dynamics of here. Right.

And so, you know, we've got to get coaches to, one, respect officials, but we also need coaches to understand what is the ability of this referee. If this is a new referee from the referee development side, like we talked about, we have to start at the basic fundamentals, like it's like teaching somebody to walk when it comes to are you standing in the right place? Are you positioning correctly? Are you doing the right movements? Are you signaling. Correct. Blowing the whistle. Right. We have to get those fundamentals down before we can move on to the next stage. How are we applying advantage properly? Is it something that makes our sport really unique and different? Is one nine percent of the sports played under water? Right. Who? The officials are standing at interesting angles on the pool deck. It can only really proceed from here. Cannot see anything down below vs.. If I'm a spectator and I'm standing and I'm sitting in the stands, I'm 20 feet above the different angle. Yeah, I can see a lot things are different.

And, you know, that's part of that parent buying piece of that as well, is it's understanding that the officials are there and whether or not you think they're doing the right thing. They really are trying to do the right thing. Right. Right. They're going off with their skill set is. And that skill set will continue to grow. Parents have seen me for years and they will still disagree with maybe my cause. And that's fine.

But it's it it's to me when it comes to the parent buying that mutual respect also works both ways. Right. Why I'm there as well. Most of it most of our senior officials have been around this for longer than any of them will ever participate in the sport. They will come and go in that short instance of their athletes and most likely their athletes will continue to get back to the sport. The same officials are coming back here. We getting back to the sport. So if you give us a mutual respect, it works both ways.

Right. What about. I'm just curious. Like you said, we run into this problem that the game is played under water and there's a lot of action that's happening under water. You get lots of different whistles.

You have the advantage rule that's being applied where sometimes it's called and sometimes it's not called. And so that can be frustrating. How what would be the best way for a parent to learn the game? Obviously, because a lot of times that I have parents as a coach come up and say, I don't know what you're doing with my kid loves it, but I have no idea what's going on. I'm wondering from your multi roles, how is the best way for a parent to learn and understand the game of waterpolo?

There are different. You know, there are different resources out there. You know, some of the resources are if you hear three whistles, exclusion, OK, but what is an exclusion area?

Why was that exclusion and that not exclusion? Right. So then they get even more confused when we give some of the hears with each whistle means why it's called one way and why it's called the next time, the same way. It's absolutely confusing. Our sport, I think, is one of the most unique sports with that idea of an advantage in almost every other sport. When the referee blows the whistle, play stops, timeouts, there's substitutions. You know, there all these different things that take place in waterpolo. When the referee blows the whistle, that's when the play begins. And so it's hard to train one if you've spent a lot of time watching other sports to kind of understand fully what's going on. Same with that idea of advantage. Where in other sports, if a foul is committed, even behind the ball, play still has to stop because a foul is committed in water. We waive off those fouls because of what's continuing to progress and transition down the pool. That I think is really hard. What I've seen from parents to buy into because. They're more focused on their individual athlete and not understanding the broader picture. It's also a really hard skill set to teach a younger official as well. So that's kind of that we're in this together. He says it's, you know, those younger officials teaching yourself to open up your vision and see the entire pool. I understand that happen there.

But you were caught focusing here and you forgot what was down there. That. And so we have to work with the officials. I think we need continue to teach the parents.

And I also think it's the coach's responsibility as well to. Also help educate their parents as it's an example of what I just said. There might be some foul happening in the back court as your team is scoring in the front court and the parents are yelling at the referee in the backcourt for not calling foul for the coach to then educate the parent.

Right. What just took place that I think can help us in the long run as well, because ultimately the coach should be held accountable for educating their parents. The referee should not be having to turn around and educate spectators right during the game about why not. But there are different resources out there. And it's like that I did the mutual respect that. I said if a parent wants to ask a referee a question during an appropriate time at the end of the game, if they're on their break and you approach him a in a professional way, most likely they'll give you those couple of minutes to answer your question. But if you don't approach them in a mutual respect, right. Or you're not respectful during the game, don't expect to hear from them at the end of the day.

Excellent points. So in terms of transitioning into a new topic here, a little bit about the whole point of the podcast is to try to create manageable strategies for sport growth. There are ways we can come together to get more kids playing the game, to get more quality play and competition opportunity. So I'm curious, again, from your perspective, what are some of the ways that you have seen or that you would recommend in terms of clubs and coaches that can attract, retain and support athletes and get more athletes into their club and maintain and engage those athletes for a long period of time so that they want to continue in the sport?

You know, there has been some wonderful sport growth pieces taking place outside the mountain zone, but there has also been some really creative ways that have been taking place inside the mountain zone.

An example of this is in New Mexico and the growth that they've had in squash ball where they have partnered as part of the swim, unless it was as part of the swim lessons to help introduce dodgeball from an early onset. They allowed, you know, a free couple of weeks to come in to play the game, to experience it through that splash ball program, which helps because a different liability and legal piece is risk mitigation behind it. But that opportunity, I think, has been great as to what they have done, whether it's changing the recruitment and the marketing piece of the marketing, being bilingual, you know, to attract other nationalities and language speaking.

That's been a great growth strategy that they've tried attacking when it comes to the Masters players of, you know, getting their kids involved.

I know quite a few Masters players who won, either their kids all play or two. They don't want their kids to play. I want to categorize.

I've always I'm fascinating. But to me, the hardest thing about our sport as well when it comes to the growth side of it is you have to have some swimming fundamental if you really can't swim. It's very difficult to continue to progress within our sport. And so that's where that that swimming I in and tie comes in really well and incorporating into the swim lessons to get it in early, because then the youngsters are building a love for both swimming and for polo and they get the best of both worlds. So that's those are a couple of strategies that I have seen that have run the numbers as well. The other side of it, too, is just what are you doing throughout the year if you're just holding practices year round? You might not get a lot of continued growth. Know once you take that that next step to traveling to different tournaments, getting outside, doing those team, building camaraderie as the parents are going out. That, I think, is where the team transitions from just being a regular team to that fool club.

That's. Really need it for the ultimate success of the year round hole that we want to see.

We've talked about this a couple of times in the past. The challenge that you gave to us a couple of years ago to say, you know, you should just pack up and travel across the Rockies and go to the career Lofland tournament that legitimately changed the trajectory of our club overall. Right. I mean, I look back at that point of men. We moved 100 kids in two weeks time back to that tournament that first time. It was crazy, but it was super fun. And every year our kids always are coming back. That travel tournament's really are the highlight of their because they get to they get to go out and be with their buddies and friends. It's even less about the waterpolo as it is just being to be with their friends and occasionally getting to play good water polo here and there. So I'd be curious, what can we do to improve the game in the mountain zone and at maybe technical? That may be tactical, but I would like just the experience of the game. You've seen all the different pools. You've seen all the different tournaments. What would you recommend in terms of how do we improve engagement?

But that's a great question, and I think it ties into exactly what we were just talking when it comes to, you know, traveling. And I understand there are some limitations behind that. But that really does improve the game within the zone if it engages where we are at within a zone. Many of those athletes that continue to travel throughout the zone to different tournaments end up playing on their ODP team. They have familiarity with those athletes. And it is a struggle with our ODP teams as well, because we are so far apart. They don't get to practice as much before they go to the championships. Right. And so being able to know each other throughout the year, build that camaraderie is huge. One thing that always makes me laugh, too, about those tournaments is the pool setup where each team kind of gets their own little corner and, you know, they set up their little snacks and then your parents interact and then you've got kids just hanging out, lounging and talking to each other all day or, you know, sitting on the benches. And should we allow a lot more of that interaction to take place at those zone tournaments, then we probably wouldn't necessarily allowed in, for instance, like what we allow here at the Utah High School State tournament, where it's a strict bench policy. But we understand at those zone tournaments, these teams have traveled hundreds of miles and they have nowhere to go hang out at the pool. Right. Then sure, they'll back camaraderie for some of these kids. They only get to play four or five weekends out of the year total to just do tournaments. Everything else is just practice. And so that, I think also helps. You know, the other interesting thing is we do have some club teams that they don't get a lot of opportunities to play in a tournament style or in a quote unquote, real game with two referees.

And, you know, the tables and everything working in. Yet when they have those opportunities, they're beating the teams that are around, which doesn't even demonstrate those coaches are wow. That are lacking the opportunities for the game, play whatever they're doing in practice.

It's it's really working right there. They're focusing on the fundamentals and they're focusing on aspects of the game that are needed to move up to that higher level. I would love to see what some of those teams are doing being implemented throughout the entire zone to overall improve the quality of play. I do think there are some areas where some states lack, whether it's fundamentals or abilities and other states are better, but it all just depends on kind of the dynamic of what's going on. Trying to grow. And so that's me alone. If, like you said, you travel to a tournament, you were able to gauge at that point where you sat in the zone. Yes. We were able to come back and make improvements. I would love to see more teams take that opportunity to actually really assess where they're at within the zone. The other piece behind that, too, would be the mountain zone, moving towards, let's say, the mountain zone championship. Moving towards, you know, a strict more jail qualify tournament. And most of our zone tournaments moving where we're getting away from all of the the 18. You mix the six. I would love us to move to a more strict boys games, girls games and mix at the younger age that I think would also show the continued growth we're having in the summer.

Right. And maybe just answer my next question. But what I wanted to ask was FlashForward, what do you want waterpolo to look like in Utah, in the mountain zone five years from now? What do you see in terms of that growth trajectory?

One that I'd love to see is I came into this admen role three and a half years ago. I wanted us by this year to have a mountain zone jail qualifier tournament. I guess Covanta caught wind of what? My mom has kind of delayed that. So once I step aside, people have to worry about that as much. But to me, in five years, if we are hosting a true geo qualifier tournament within this mountain zone, that to me then shows we've made the growth. We've made transition to being a more legitimate zone in the sense that our number wise and we have a number we have too many teams then who are wanting to go to geos and they're having to compete for those spots. That would be my ultimate dream for us to get to that point to to align with what the other zones are doing when it comes to that. That, to me, shows our growth and it also shows our improvement in capability.

Right. When I be curious to know when you are involved in interacting with referees from across the country or maybe on calls with as a zone chair with USA. So what what are those things that you take away from a leadership role that says, like, this is what we need to work on? Right. I mean, obviously, the jail calls is something that we want to do, continue to try to bring legitimacy to the waterpolo in the mountain zone. What what are the top two or three things that you feel like as clubs, as athletes, as parents that we can do together to help continue to try to create that awareness of the sport, legitimacy of the play from a national perspective.

You know, from a national side.

But I'd love to see is. I would love to see more varsity polo within our five states. Right now, we have the LSU women's program. We have the men's program at Air Force Academy. And then we have the upcoming program at Ottawa in Arizona as well. Yes. So, you know, I would love to see more varsity polo in the zone. I think that would also then allow younger athletes to go watch some of that higher level polo to see the, you know, the transition from high school to the potential for collegiate play. That would also help with referee development in the sense that we could have more referees within the mountain zone refereeing within the local conferences for our teams within the area right now because we lack a lot of collegiate teams. Most of the referees in those conferences are based out of that, the main area where most of the teams are based. In that conference. And so it's the conference is not necessarily willing to expense to pay for, let's say, a referee that led to New Mexico to go do one or two games a year. The grand perfective for them. So we're lacking some of those pieces. We also don't have high school sanction guapo in any of the five states. We could get one of the states in a lot of talk about Utah over the years because of just the sheer number of teams we have in Utah, which is almost three times the rest of the entire zone around. So having having some kind of high school sanction polo, one of the five states with tremendously help, our ability, as well as more water polo regulated pools than the majority of them within the zone are here in Utah. Arizona has a couple of beautiful pools saying with New Mexico. But, you know, having two or three pools that you have access to can also limit what that growth would look like in five years with the viability.

How many teams can have operating in three or four, three pools? Yeah, right. This has been this has been a fantastic conversation. I'm curious if you have any final thoughts or anything that you'd like to share.

You know, the last thing that I would think about, you know, growing the future of this sport would be continuing to travel. But understanding with the expectations of what water polo is that I do think is false within a weakness and opportunity and a threat to our sport. And that really is water polo at the collegiate level, the national level here at the local level. It is a weekend sport. It is a club sport that is played on the weekends. And that is Friday, Saturday, Sundays.

I do think it's important for expectations to be sent within if you are participating in the mountains zone and if you do not participate in ODP and if you want to move on to the collegiate level, you will play on Sundays. Yeah. That is our sport. It will continue to be our sport moving forward.

And I understand that can be limitations, that those limitations can also, if they're not addressed upfront about what our sport looks like at all, facets can be detrimental in the long run because it it hinders the team's ability to travel by not setting expectations are a front. That would be my final point that I make about the future of our sport. Final thing that I would say is we're all in this together, finished for the last couple of months for people not being able to play. I feel terrible for the seniors in all of the states that haven't been able to play when one amazing thing about being an official, the travels within the zone for a number of years as I watch some of these athletes play the sport for six years. I watched them improve. I watched them decline. Crazy things right there. I get more frustrated on the pool deck because of the way they're playing, because I know what they're capable of. Right. And so that to me has also been kind of a sadness of not being able to see some of these seniors that I've seen for all the growing up and grow up and not be able to officiate maybe their last game. So that, I think is sad. But we're all in this together. Our sport is in a great position. USA water polo is in a great position and the zone will only continue to grow and get better as time goes on.

Fantastic. Well, one of my very last things, one of my goals for this podcast is to create the world's best waterpolo playlist. All right. And so I gave you some heads up that we're gonna do this. But what is what song do you want to add to this salty splash song list? You know, that song I just totally get you pumped to watch water. Polo or play water polo or I guess referee water polo. I mean, you have pump up jams, too, before you get onto ref.

We always have come from. Anybody ever notice before Tyson does a big game. I will put on headphones and I will leave the pool deck and I will listen to a song in the song that I listened to before I referee.

Any high level game is I'm bossy by police and just.

That's my go to jam. That is the jam. OK. All right. Well, this is going to be the best love.

It is going to be the best playlist ever. I'm done with the first. Add to it for sure. So, hey, Tyson again. Thank you so much for taking a little some time out to talk about water polo on this salty splash here, Will.

I'm sure that that we great some great feedback. Any other last final thoughts? Parting thoughts? No, man, I appreciate it. Enjoy that time. Let's hopefully we get back into the water here soon and you can start blowing the whistle and we can start coach and get those kids going back and forth. Absolutely.

Go. Thanks, Tyson. Bye bye.

Thanks again to Tyson Heath, USA Waterpolo, Mountain Zone chair and referee. Please subscribe. Great. Give a five star review and share the podcast. If you just can't get enough waterpolo podcasts, check out Steve. Career is pot off the deck for Steve talks to many of the best coaches in the game. He also like Tony Acevedo's podcast, the Tony Azevedo podcast posted by Dave Williamson as they look at waterpolo through the lens of Tony Spinel Olympic Games and the future focused mindset. Check out what's going on in Texas at the Texas Waterpolo podcast and in the Midwest at the nearside low podcast. All very interesting conversations. Working to support the game we love. We are just trying to make a journey to be a voice for sport growth in the waterpolo wilderness. Always honor the game.

Keep your head on a pivot until next time. Peace.

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