Bart Bright interview - 2021-02-15, 10.14 AM.mp3

Bart Bright interview - 2021-02-15, 10.14 AM.mp3: Audio automatically transcribed by Sonix

Bart Bright interview - 2021-02-15, 10.14 AM.mp3: this mp3 audio file was automatically transcribed by Sonix with the best speech-to-text algorithms. This transcript may contain errors.

intro music:
Welcome to Grieve with Ease, a podcast where we talk about the many signs of loss and death on each episode, you'll hear from a cross-section of men and women who share how they dealt with loss, found comfort and even humor during what many consider a very dark time. The show is designed to bring comfort, to answer questions and let you know you are not alone. Now here's your host, Martika Whylly.

Martika Whylly:
Bart Bright lost his son Kevin to suicide on August 14th, 2018. He was 29 years old while grieving, and his wife wanted to understand why their son took his life. Bart now is dedicated to educating other parents about the subject. He also facilitates Mar-Anon meetings each week to support people affected by others, THC, cannabis use. Welcome, Bart!

Martika Whylly:
Well, you have a painful story to share.

Bart Bright:
Yeah, unfortunately, but I just try to see what I can do to help others.

Martika Whylly:
Well, that's what we do when we go through this, you know, pain and trauma. We help others.

Bart Bright:
Right, exactly. And then. And helps us.

Martika Whylly:
Oh, yeah. Definitely helps us. And it helps others and. Yeah, my big thing was the suicidal rate, you know, how people get really depressed when somebody they really close dies and they don't want to live. And I've heard way too many stories of people passing weeks, months, sometimes a year or two after somebody they really love died. So it's sad.

Bart Bright:
Oh, yeah, you're right. It's almost like a snowball effect or something.

Martika Whylly:
Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I've seen that in my own family.

Bart Bright:
Yeah, so sorry.

Martika Whylly:
Hmm. So tell me a little bit about your son that passed.

Bart Bright:
Ok, so Kevin, let's see he was funny and smart and and gifted. He played the piano and and so he tried out soccer and baseball and all that, a little league.

Bart Bright:
But, you know, mostly he was more interested in piano and that type of thing. And so then he what happened is when he was 15, I a sophomore in high school, he came to us and he said that, you know, he was depressed and then he was smoking marijuana.

Bart Bright:
So we we said, would you be willing to get help, you know, and then we would have done something anyway. But but he wanted to get help. So we went to a therapist and actually he went and saw a therapist and they recommended me. They did a big evaluation and they realized, yes, he is depressed. They confirm that. So then what they did is they suggested that he go to a wilderness program. So I went to a wilderness program in Utah and he was there. Oh, gosh. I believe he was there for six weeks.

Bart Bright:
And then and he seemed to really seem to help him. And it was, you know, hiking, camping out the whole time. And so and of course, therapy. And we'd have weekly phone calls. And that seemed to help him quite a bit. And then after that, he went to a therapeutic boarding school in Arizona and Phoenix, Arizona, and did really well there, got really good grades and really good reviews on that from the staff and the teachers.

Bart Bright:
And then it was all an all boys school. So he had a friend there that went to another school after that year. So anyway, after his junior year, he had a friend who went to a all boys coed boarding school in Virginia and he wanted to follow his friend. And it was coed and it wasn't as strict and all that. So we thought, well, it's kind of a progression because he did such a good job, you know, at that school, we didn't think he was ready to come back home because we thought the counselors, everybody thought they would just kind of fall back with his friends and go back to using marijuana and all that. So we said, OK, you know, so he went there, he joined the cross-country team, when he was there at this boarding school in Virginia and he became friends with the kid on the cross-country team who lived right near the school. So he wasn't it didn't it wasn't a border, but he lived there. So then he'd go to his house and that's when he started smoking pot again at his house in Virginia. So he started he went from doing great, getting really good grades to going, started to go downhill. So the teachers spoke to him and they realized that he just opened up and he was smoking marijuana again. And so they gave him a mental a medical leave because they really, really enjoyed him. They liked his personality. And he was a really good addition, they said. But they couldn't keep him there if he was using marijuana and not doing well. So anyway they say he'd come back once he gets some health, healthy habits behind him and all that. So he went to like Marijuana Anonymous and got therapist again while I lived at our house.

Bart Bright:
And and then he turned 18 well, let me back up. So unfortunately, he didn't he did not become healthier and end up using more and more marijuana came back with his friends. And so, you know, we. He said, we can't live here if you're going to be using and he said, OK, I won't do it anymore. So when he turned 18, we found marijuana in his pants pocket and that was a zero tolerance situation with us. So we said you need to do to leave. So it was really hard to tell him to leave, but that was the agreement. And so, anyway, from there, it was 11 years of, you know, him coming back and say, OK, I'm ready to go to rehab again. And us trying that again and counseling. And and so it just, you know, he would take like one step forward, two steps back he'd be clean and sober for maybe a month or two. And then it got to the point where he just got his mental illness got worse and we saw the more high. It's the high THC, you know, marijuana, the people cannabis that is very popular these days that he was using. He wasn't using the stuff I was using in college. I got like three percent THC, probably consuming, you know, 30 percent THC. And you actually got to a point where we figure he's probably up to about 60 or 70 percent THC concentrates.

Bart Bright:
And because he kept building a more and more of a tolerance, you know, and so we didn't know about it at the time. But when he would go basically have these psychotic episodes, we didn't know what that was. And then later on, we found out that it's actually a it's a diagnosis in the DSM five, which is a decent five, is the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. It's used by professionals in the mental health field. And we didn't know anything about it at the time, but we learned about it. So it's called the cannabis induced psychosis. And so we just got worse and worse. And then unfortunately, on August 14th, 2018, he died by suicide.

Martika Whylly:
Well. Well, it's it's unfortunate that after all the trying to get them clean, that just it just didn't work. I yeah, there must be quite a bit of. I don't know, guilt or, you know, what more could you have done, but in certain circumstances, you can only do so much.

Bart Bright:
And then looking back, thank you. Looking back on it, you know, I know I contributed to it. I've been al- anon for many years and just started these Mar-anon meetings on Zune and mar-anon the marijuana version of Al-anon. It's a relatively new program. And one of the main sayings is, you know, I didn't cause it. I can't control it and I can't cure it, you know, but I can contribute to it. And I know that my depression I had I guess you'd probably call or I guess a term nonprofessional term would be I had depression with a smile. I'd go out into the public, you know, put a smile on and I'd be, you know, happy go lucky Bart and all that. But then I'd come home. A lot of times I'd be depressed. And so I was around and physically, physically. And we had dinner together every night we take our camping trips and different activities, I was coaching, soccer team, etc. But I just wasn't there emotionally a lot of times. Sometimes I was. Sometimes I wasn't also his older brother, we found out later was just, again, very sneaky. I don't know if it was he was jealous of him or whatever. But, you know, he I don't know if, you know, I don't I really don't talk about his older brother because, you know, a great, you know, person and all that.

Bart Bright:
But he had his issues, too. And we didn't know that some of his issues you rubbed on to our rubbed off on to our son our youngest son Kevin.

Bart Bright:
They just want to keep the anonymity of my my oldest son, you know, going to keep his anonymity. But anyway, we just found out later, again that that affected him, too. And he was also very quiet. Our older son was not he was much more extroverted. So we just thought, oh, he's just different. Like a lot of kids, you know, one kid is different than the other kid. And so but we didn't realize that inside and being quiet and all that, it was because he was depressed and that type of.

Martika Whylly:
Yeah, it's it's hard to when they're acting, it's you're acting like you're OK when you're not. And so people don't know. And that's it's hard to see the signs of suicide because just because of that, there are signs to be aware of. I did talk to some of the earlier had an interview with a Frank King. He's a suicide prevention speaker.

Bart Bright:
Well.

Martika Whylly:
Yeah. Frank King, you might want to look him up.

Bart Bright:
Yeah Frank King.

Martika Whylly:
Frank King, he's called the. Mental comedian, well, I think that's that's his subtitle.

Bart Bright:
OK, good, thank you.

Martika Whylly:
But if you mention if you look if you Google him, he'll he'll come up, suicide prevention speaker. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, it's it's, um. This is why I want to talk to people about suicide as well as just the grieving part of it, because usually when somebody has lost somebody close to them, especially if they're young or it's sudden, they have a very hard time dealing with it and.

Martika Whylly:
Most of the times, and I don't know what the percentages of this, but a lot of times people are also suicidal when they they've lost somebody. I know I was for a while, actually, when my mom died. So it can be very traumatic. And then how do you deal with that?

Bart Bright:
So, yeah, so true. So we think we're not sure, but we think this was his third or fourth attempt suicide attempt and even told us one time on the phone he said, you know, when I do it, don't worry, I'm going to do it in a way that, you know, it's going to be painless and all that type of thing.

Bart Bright:
And we're like, oh, we know that we were nearby. It was hours away. And also we were triggers for him. My wife and I. So if we were ever around, when he especially when he got healthier, you know, that's not a word, I don't think. But as he went downhill as far as his mental health, went we were triggers, so even if we did drive, there two hours away where he was. We were just unfortunately trigger him.

Bart Bright:
And and so when he was telling us this on the phone, we were in the car and we said, oh, you know, call 911 and you call the suicide hotline. And he had all that information and he goes, no, no, I just want that, you know, I do do it. It's going to be you know, I'm not going to do it in a way where I won't be feeling the pain.

Bart Bright:
So it was almost like he was preparing us and I guess he was preparing us. And so when he actually did it, I had seen him. I had seen him off and on, not my wife, because my wife triggered him even more than I did. But I had seen them off and on here and there. And when I did see him, it was just so sad because he was basically psychotic and, you know, like almost like a walking zombie. And I could tell he was suffering so bad. So when I did hear about his taking his life, you know, I thought I would never want to live like that in that much pain and suffering.

Bart Bright:
And so I would I would want to go also.

Bart Bright:
And so I was kind of relieved in a way, you know, again, that I felt guilty for feeling that way. But then on the other hand, he had chosen for about two years or so not to get professional help and just to again use more and more high THC cannabis every day, which made him worse and worse and worse. And so that's when another reason why I'm trying to get the story out, because so many people think it's medicine, it's good for you.

Bart Bright:
It's all good. It's natural. Well, there's not really much natural, about 80 percent or 70 percent THC cannabis. You know, you have to you have to process it in a way. In fact, a laboratory is now process it in a way to get it up close to one hundred percent THC. And so there's nothing natural about that. And I've even heard more and more people and I saw it with our son, Kevin. You feel better at first. It's almost like one step forward, like have a glass of wine or beer or two glasses of wine, two beers. You can feel better at first, but then as you keep using more and more, you feel worse. And that's what that's what we witnessed.

Martika Whylly:
It just kept getting worse.

Bart Bright:
Yeah. And we're not and I'm not saying that no one should use cannabis. I'm what I'm saying is all the research I've done now since he passed away for the developing brain till about twenty five, the high THC cannabis is not a good thing.

Martika Whylly:
Not a good thing. No, I you wouldn't think that the high content would be. Really helpful usually with cannabis.

Martika Whylly:
From what I understand, there's two kinds and one kind of makes you feel drowsy. The other one kind of makes you feel more focused. But yeah, I mean. I wonder what his thoughts were, you know, what he was thinking, why he was depressed, that sort of thing, because I think some of these drugs are more of an enhancer. If he was already feeling that way, it would just be worse when you take drugs or alcohol. For me, I noticed, like, if I'm in a happy mood and I have a glass of wine and now I want to dance, but if I'm pissed, I might be more upset.

Bart Bright:
Right. And one glass of wine is one thing or one less. Even shot of tequila is one thing.

Martika Whylly:
But to have a whole bottle.

Bart Bright:
I mean, really, when I was in college, I would say this is about 1980, I was probably using cannabis that would say about five percent THC. Well, he was using cannabis at 70 percent. So that's 14 times more. So you think about one glass of wine versus 14 glasses of wine, you know, or one shot of whiskey or whatever, or tequila compared to 14 shots, you know, one after another after another. So there's a huge difference.

Martika Whylly:
Oh, yeah, definitely. So, yeah, he was just kind of drown his sorrows, it sounds like, in the in the marijuana and the cannabis.

Bart Bright:
Right. At first it didn't feel better, but then it made him worse and worse.

Martika Whylly:
Mm hmm. I would think that if he had spent maybe more time away in the wilderness, you know, now, of course, there's different studies about how long it takes for you to get into a habit is it 30 days, 60 days, I've been hearing now it's 100 days before you get into a habit where you're not even having to think about brushing your teeth or working out in the morning, one of those habits. And it can work in the opposite for not being on something. Sure. I wonder if that would have been something. But then again, you never know what people are thinking, what they're going to do, you can't control people.

Bart Bright:
Right.

Martika Whylly:
And, you know, it's hard to hear somebody who's young and has kind of slipped through the cracks, if you will, and just, you know, taking their own life. But then again, when they're in that much pain.

Bart Bright:
Right.

Martika Whylly:
Sometimes suicide for people is the only way out.

Bart Bright:
That's how he felt. And again, I think, again, like I said, it was his third or fourth attempt as far as we know. And yet, because he was in so much pain, I know I wouldn't want to live like that. So, you know, he kept you kept hearing again. Medical marijuana is great. It's all natural.

Bart Bright:
And that's my my my medicine and my medicine. So when he was, again, let's say, going to Marijuana Anonymous and been eating healthy, exercising all that, he was doing really well, you know. But then, you know, whatever reason, maybe he'd get depressed or maybe a friend would come or someone else and say, hey, you know, you get what you get high with me? Then you go back. Back down.

Martika Whylly:
Back down again. Yeah, yeah. Again, it's a circle of people that you're around to.

Bart Bright:
Right? Exactly.

Martika Whylly:
Yeah, yeah.

Bart Bright:
So what I did is I found this organization actually a couple, one of them is called Johnnys Ambassadors. And she also she also lost her son to one of the big contributors was cannabis induced psychosis. He jumped off a building at 19 years old and he was a really good student and again, seemed like a very loving, happy, good family and all that. But, you know, he got into this heavy duty dabbing, if you heard of dabbing. But that's really popular. Unfortunately, now it's getting more and more popular and it's where they take something like it's called shatter or something like butter. And there's different names. But let's it shatter and it can have, you know, 65 to 90 percent, sometimes even higher THC. And they put it in a sophisticated bong and they light it with a small blow torch torch and they suck way deep into their lungs. And so, again, you're looking at a hit that I took off a joint, say, five percent THC in 1980 when I was young compared to, let's say, 80 percent. So again, 16 times more in one hit.

Bart Bright:
And if your brain is still developing until you're about twenty five, I've heard more and more people having problems with it. I mean, big time.

Bart Bright:
And so as I learn more about this, I learned about Mar-anon, which is the marijuana version of Al-anon, like I said, and it was see this group that was started about four years ago by a small group of people and based on the 12 steps of Al-anon and the Marijuana Anonymous. And so then they were just online on emails. There weren't enough people that were willing to go to a meeting in a local area to have meetings locally. And then, of course, you got covid. So I went I found it. I said, what about zoom meetings? And so the woman who's still involved and who put together the website, she said, yeah, that sounds good. So I put togetther two a zoom meetings every week. So, you know, Mar-anon meetings, and that's we started out with like three people. And now we have like we average like ten to 15 people every meeting. And I keep getting more and more people who are requesting these meetings. So it's helping I think them and it's helping me. So

Martika Whylly:
That's that's awesome. Now, do you have like a link or an email address that people can if they were interested or you...

Bart Bright:
Yeah, I would love that. So, Bart, like, well, I guess like Bart Simpson. Oh, my gosh. So [email protected]. And then Jay, like James Bright like a bright light. So Bart J. Bright at Gmail dot com.

Martika Whylly:
OK, ok. Well that's good.

Bart Bright:
Yeah.

Martika Whylly:
And what advice would you give to other parents whose of teenagers who are depressed and are using marijuana?

Bart Bright:
So I think no one would be to there's a book, let's see, and it's called If They're Using Marijuana and or any other drugs, there's a book called From Monsters to Miracles. From Monsters to Miracles says Parent Driven Recovery Tools that Work. It's written by Annette Edens, Ph.D. from Monsters of Miracles. That's a it's a very good book for parents. Of course, there's lots of other resources out there. I would say realized that, again, just because they're using marijuana doesn't mean it's OK and doesn't mean oh, that's just part of growing up because, again, it's totally it's like a hard drug now when you're talking about 80 percent THC versus Steptoe's a week before, because, again, that's nothing is the more it's just like alcohol. If you're if your son or daughter starts to experiment with alcohol and let's just say has a sip here or there or has a beer, you know, here and there, whatever, that's one thing. But if they have, you know, one beer the first time or one glass of wine and then two, then three and four, they're a much better chance of becoming addicted. And that's another fallacy. It's another myth. When people say it's not addictive, well, it's just like alcohol. Most people don't get addicted to alcohol. But the younger you start and especially like you say, if you had depression or whatever and you're trying to self medicate, the better chance you have of becoming addicted to marijuana or alcohol, you know, so I would just say study about it. Don't just don't believe all these myths about it's no big deal. It's natural. I mean, poison ivy is natural, but people shouldn't eat it. And, you know, so it's like this because it's natural doesn't mean it's good for you. And also, like I say here, it's a medicine. It's good for you. It's going to help my son or daughter. And we actually thought it would help our son at first and not at first, but down the road, we thought, well, it's better than him taking a hardcore pharmaceutical drug.

Bart Bright:
But then we realized it was not good, you know? So anyway, I think being educated is really important. And that's where, again, that if anyone emails me, I can give them resources like Johnny's ambassadors.org Has a lot of good PhDs and people who are pharmacologists, who give information instead of somebody who works in the cannabis industry or the cannabis lobby. They're making obviously money from that. So they're going to say good things about it. These people that I listen to and study from are they don't don't get money from the industry. They're actually PhDs or they studied pharmacology and that type of thing.

Martika Whylly:
Well, that's wonderful.

Martika Whylly:
Yeah. What other questions do I have for you? You answered all my questions there Bart.

Bart Bright:
I mean, I didn't yeah, I think I think the reason I'm so passionate right now is because because there's so much misinformation, you know, and and I again, I thought the same thing. I was wrong, know, I thought it was harmless and all that. And I learned the hard way, you know, that it's not harmless, you know. Now, again, if you're older, you start doing it this after twenty five or even if you start doing a little bit before twenty five, but you don't have an addictive personality or you don't, you're not trying to self medicate, you're just doing it, you know, whatever here and there that's different. But you know, but there's that percentage of people you put, you're going away, you're playing Russian roulette, you know. And so it's better just to, you know, when they talk about recreational marijuana, recreational cannabis, it's like, well, to me, recreational would be going going out and playing volleyball or or doing something outside recreationally or sport or having fun playing board games or whatever, dancing or whatever. Yeah, but you know that to me that's recreation, not taking drugs. I mean...

Martika Whylly:
I know it always sounds weird when they say it's a recreation, but I guess there's a difference between taking it because of pain, like physical pain, because some people I mean, I just bought my cat some CBD oil.

Martika Whylly:
I know it's not THC it's something different, but it does come from cannabis. And he was throwing up a lot. So I thought it's either that or I take him to the vet and I'm really iffy. I don't trust much many vets because they take advantage of people. But I heard a lot of good things about the CBD oil. And so far he hasn't been throwing I mean, it's just been a few days, but he hasn't been throwing up as much.

Bart Bright:
That's great. And I mean, CBD, you know, is if it works, that's great.

Martika Whylly:
You know, again, it's going to stay in moderation, everything in moderation. And what you're saying about your son being so young with the THC, I first started experiment with marijuana. I was twenty six, I believe. OK, so I was just at the age. And it's funny when you mention that I my mom died from suicide.

Bart Bright:
I'm so sorry. I'm sorry.

Martika Whylly:
And she jumped off a bridge. It was nothing to do with THC. But I believe that ever since when I was 15, when she died, that she has been my personal guardian angel. And I never did drugs after she died.

Martika Whylly:
Like I'd never turn to I mean, I drank a few beers here and there. I'm sure I had a at a party, but it was never a daily thing. And I believe when I did try to twenty six, I think she said it's OK, you could, you could just try it, you know, it didn't like it didn't become like a debilitating thing for me. Thank God. Until I heard your story. And then it made me think about how she's with me, how our loved ones are with us.

Bart Bright:
I agree.

Martika Whylly:
And pass on and in that every death Bart is a suicide.

Martika Whylly:
Do you know that every death is a suicide?

Bart Bright:
Oh that's interesting.

Martika Whylly:
That it is. I read that in a spiritual book at first. When I read that, I thought, that's bull, baloney. That is not true. But every death really is a suicide. We choose when we leave. Well, it's so. So it's not a sin. You know that Kevin did what he did. It was his time he felt it. You know, he's not in pain anymore. And, you know, it's just the people that are left behind feel a bit. What's the word? I'm afraid he had betrayed a little bit, you know.

Bart Bright:
Right.

Martika Whylly:
It's like, well, you left and you know why?

Bart Bright:
Right. I mean, in our case, again, it was different because he was suffering so much.

Martika Whylly:
Mm hmm.

Bart Bright:
Yeah. So I totally understood it. And I knew that I would want to do that myself, you know, if I was in that much pain and suffering. So. So we were, you know, somewhat prepared. You never, of course, are 100 percent prepared, but we knew that now he's not in any more pain. He's not suffering so much.

Martika Whylly:
Now, let me ask you this, because I ask a lot of people this question. Have you sensed him or felt him around you since his past?

Bart Bright:
You know, have I had a dream and I've had some, you know, slight images of Kevin, but this was the most vivid and the dream was him. You know, I thought, you know, I'm not really sure if he was still alive or not, but he was in his condition. And I could see how he, you know, took his life. And so but it was interesting because, you know, if I saw that right now and you showed me a photo, I'd never seen a photo. I don't think there was a photo of what he did to take his life. But I'm sure I would be, of course, very shocking, very upsetting and all that. But in the dream, it was kind of like, OK, Dad, this is how I ended my life. But and it wasn't so it wasn't about that. It wasn't about how he did it. It was just a loving interchange with my son and I. And I don't think any words were spoken, but I felt the love between the two of us, so.

Martika Whylly:
And that's always amazing. Yeah, that was.

Bart Bright:
Go ahead.

Martika Whylly:
Sorry. I was just going to say my mom was showed up in my dreams a few times since she died. And that always makes me feel better. Like she's still alive. She's still with me. She's not dead. Death is really just an illusion. We can't kill energy.

Bart Bright:
I agree.

Martika Whylly:
Spiritual beings having a human experience and we're all going to die. We're not you know, people assume you're going to live to be an old age and then you die. I mean, that's just usually the nature of things, but it doesn't always happen that way. It could be two year old, two years old and die.

Bart Bright:
You're right.

Martika Whylly:
You know, and that's hard for the family. But for the two year old, they're like, oh, well, you know.

Bart Bright:
Right now I agree with you. We are spiritual beings. Number one. By far.

Martika Whylly:
Yeah, but it's good to talk about the grief. It's good to talk about how, you know, somebody is passed and what how we feel and the effects and, you know, the maybe the signs afterwards. You know, some people have these amazing stories of their loved ones showing up, whether it's in a dream or sending them feathers or dimes or animals, you know, that sort of thing, just to give them a sense of. What 's the word?

Bart Bright:
I'm OK.

Martika Whylly:
Yes, yes, very much so.

Bart Bright:
Yeah, I agree.

Bart Bright:
You know, I feel like he's OK and and then he, you know, showing his love. And of course, I was reflect my love back to him and that, you know, so I.

Martika Whylly:
Mm hmm. And how's your wife doing?

Bart Bright:
It's, I think, harder on her. OK, so we both volunteer a lot. She volunteers for the National Alliance on Mental Illness to honor Kevin and to give back. She's the president of our county for that organization. And so she's, you know, doing that. And I think the more we can educate people in, the more she's educating people, the better she feels that they are honoring Kevin. But, yes, obviously very hard. And so I think then, of course, with covid, we like to travel. So like most everybody, not a lot of traveling right now. So but we are supporting each other. And and I think definitely our Al-anon on program, the Mar-anon program. And actually I started doing Alcoholics Anonymous in July of last year. Don't tell anybody it's supposed to be anonymous, not just kidding, but anyway. So that's really helped me. And I know it's helped her because that way I'm not I wasn't a big time, you know, extreme alcoholic. But I did drink too much sometimes to self medicate because of my my sadness and all that. But since I stopped doing that, I'm feeling a lot better overall. And I know she feels better about it, about me and about our relationship.

Martika Whylly:
Well, that's awesome, that's very good. That's good to hear. Yeah, that is something, because sometimes when the child dies, it kind of breaks up the family. I've seen I've seen that before. You know, unless you get therapy together, group counseling, something to that effect, it can break up the family. I've seen it too many times.

Bart Bright:
I totally agree. And if we weren't going to counseling and if we were doing the Al-anon meetings and all that, then and if I was still drinking, I could definitely see that we wouldn't be together anymore.

Martika Whylly:
Mm hmm. Yeah. And you need people that love you in your life is so important. Love is my favorite drug.

Bart Bright:
Oh I agree.

Martika Whylly:
Yeah. And this and doing this podcast, I get a lot of love. So it's like a. What do you call it medication for me.

Bart Bright:
That's great. Yeah, I really appreciate it yeah....

Martika Whylly:
Now and I appreciate you for sharing because it you know, I get people that will agree to do this and then they don't hear from them anymore. And I and I get it. I understand that it's not easy to talk about death. You know, something that is a bit of a dark topic and that brings up brings up a lot of painful memories. And and most people really just don't want to share that and then have everybody else listening to that. So I really do appreciate you. And I thank you for your bravery and courage for coming on.

Bart Bright:
Yeah, sure. Appreciate you doing this and your love and support.

Martika Whylly:
Mm hmm. So where can people reach you? And I know you did say your email address, but I wouldn't mind if you repeated it one more time.

Bart Bright:
Oh, sure. Yeah. Thank you. So, Bart, J as in James Bright bright like the bright lights, Bart J Bright at Gmail dot com.

Martika Whylly:
Thank you so much, Bart. Thank you for sharing your story with us.

Bart Bright:
Thank you, Martika. I really appreciate it. You take care.

Martika Whylly:
You too.

outro music:
You've been listening to the Grieve with Ease podcast with your host, Martika Whylly. We hope you found comfort with what you heard. Be sure to leave a rating and review of the Grieve with ease podcast show and visit our website at Grieve with ease dotcom.

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